Angela Connell-Richards: 0:30

All right, Welcome back to the RTO Superhero Podcast. Today we're untangling one of the most misunderstood standards in the 2025 framework Standard 2.2, specifically around language literacy, numeracy and digital skills Maycheck. We've had a lot of questions on this on our forum from members, but you've also heard about it. I've heard about it. There's been a lot of different types of information that is coming out with regards to language, language literacy and digital skills, so it's clear that many RTOs are still unsure of what is required and whether they need to go out and purchase a fancy LLN or digital literacy tools for their students. What do you think?

Maciek Fibrich: 1:24

Let's just call it difference in opinions, right? Look, as with anything in this industry, if you ask 10 people the same question, you only get 25 different answers, and that's no different here. So I mean, we're specifically going to unpack, as you said, 2.2 today. Specifically going to unpack, as you said, uh, 2.2 today and um and there's. But yeah, like you said, there's been a lot, of, a lot of discussion online, um, a lot of chats, no doubt, between your clients and my clients and and so forth, and my opinion is that not that much has changed in everything that we've spoken about already about the LLNN, other than they've just added the digital literacy component to it. A lot of people are talking about that. You have to do a formal assessment prior to enrolment, and I just don't think that's necessarily true in every instance.

Angela Connell-Richards: 2:27

Yeah, yeah, and I agree with that as well, and we're going to be looking at two very different units today and identifying what is the difference between, in particular, looking at digital skills with those two units. So, at its core, yep at its core.

Maciek Fibrich: 2:45

I was just going to say, yeah, go for it go.

Angela Connell-Richards: 2:49

You go, because this might lead on to what you're going to say anyway. So it's called standard 2.2 says that rtos must, before enrollment, review the learner's skills and competencies and advise whether the training product is suitable. That includes language, literacy, numeracy and digital skills. Not after enrolment, not halfway through, but before they even pay. But what? Does that really mean.

Maciek Fibrich: 3:15

Yeah, so again, as it says, so standard 2.2 from that area, vet students are advised prior to enrolment, as you just said, about the suitability of the training product for them, taking into account the students' skills and competencies. That hasn't really changed between the 15 and 25 standards. We've always been required under Standard 5, 5.1, 5.2, to inform the student about the suitability, which is again, without going on a tangent, why I've always been a supporter of using the word application for enrolment as opposed to enrolment form, and I think we share that similar vibe. Let's call it that. And then it says the NVR RTO demonstrates taking into account the requirements of the training product. Now, that's really critical there. Taking into account the requirements of the training product, which is why we'll look at two different units later on of the training product, which is why we'll look at two different units later on. It has procedures in place, again critical. So we're talking about a procedure that takes into account the product type that you're enrolling students for.

Maciek Fibrich: 4:17

So an RTO may have different procedures for different products and a product, if anyone doesn't know, may be a qualification, it might be a skill set, it might be a unit of competency or, if they're still using modules. A module, so a procedure, must review, prior to enrolment, the skills competencies of the prospective student, vet student which again we've often done, whether that's using the event reporting questions or other questionnaire and then so including the language, literacy, numeracy proficiency and digital literacy and then, based on the outcome of that review, it provides advice to each prospective vet student about whether the training product is suitable. Where I think that changes the game for a lot of people is a lot of people that want to bypass the let's call it, the interview stage or the checking stage, by doing direct enrolment and start whenever. That is something that I think a lot of RTOs may get unstuck with, where they say, yeah, enrol and start at any time, versus how do you address that? Based on the outcome, it provides advice to a prospective student. What are your thoughts?

Angela Connell-Richards: 5:31

My thoughts around that is, ensuring that we're preparing the students prior to enrolment for successful completion, and that's where I see we're assessing the students prior to enrolment on whether they're, firstly, suitable for undertaking this training and secondly is would they successfully, with their current skills and knowledge, successfully be able to complete the training? And, in particular, when we're looking at language, literacy and digital skills, do they have the required skills in order to complete the assessment side of the training?

Maciek Fibrich: 6:07

Correct. So, once we've done the review though and I'm using the word review versus assess, because, again, just to differentiate what it talks about in the standards but it then says, based on the outcome of the review, so you have to have a procedure in place to review. And then it says, based on the outcome of the review, so you have to have a procedure in place to review. And then it says, based on the outcome of the review, it being the RTO, provides advice to each prospective vet student about whether the training product is suitable for them. So where RTOs have that direct enrolment process and this is again prior to enrolment how do we ensure that they are?

Angela Connell-Richards: 6:50

compliant and, for me, what I would recommend to and I do recommend to our clients. It can be a number of things. The review can be a language literacy and numeracy assessment a language literacy and numeracy assessment. It could be part of your enrolment form. So you have some questions that you ask within the enrolment form. It could be required skills and knowledge prior to enrolment, such as they may need to hold a certain qualification, or they may need to have had a certain number of years of experience within an industry sector, or it may be that they've undertaken some professional development. So it's really reviewing their skills and knowledge against the unit of competency or the qualification, the training product that they're going to be undertaking.

Maciek Fibrich: 7:45

Yeah, 100% agree.

Maciek Fibrich: 7:47

But where I think a lot of RTOs may fall over is going to be that based on the outcome of the review.

Maciek Fibrich: 7:55

So, looking at 2.2b, where it says, based on the outcome of the review, it provides advice to each prospective vet student.

Maciek Fibrich: 8:02

So where I'm seeing that these standards are taking is that the enrolment process becomes a much more tailored approach as opposed to a straight out enrol whenever you want type scenario. That's where I'm thinking that there may be a difference in interpretation between auditors or assessors, ASCA assessors, quality assessors or there might be changes to RTO's processes where they've, according to 2.2b, they need to provide advice to each prospective student based on the outcome of the review. So I'm going to suggest that a quality process would be you capture that information as part of the application for enrolment, Then you review it in whichever way your system is built for, and again, it may be a simple review if it's a unit of competency or it may be a much more complex review if it's a diploma or higher or just a longer duration course. But then you say to the student hey, we've reviewed your application, we think you're suitable for this. And here's, you know, almost using the CRICOS process. Here's your letter of offer or here's your acceptance email to say we've accepted your application.

Angela Connell-Richards: 9:37

Yeah, we're certainly seeing that as well and we've actually seen that across the board with a lot of the new standards. It is very similar to the National Code and the requirements under international education. We're actually taking some of the documents that we've created for international education and bringing them now into domestic market, because we've seen there was other areas like performance monitoring. That also falls under support services. But also, how are you ensuring that the student is keeping on track with their studies as well?

Maciek Fibrich: 10:13

Yeah, correct, and that intervention, that sort of early intervention whilst it's not terminology that's being used, but that intent I'm seeing in standard two as well. So we spoke about the whole concept of those literacy and digital assessment providers that are out there and they do a great job for what they do. So I guess the question is does every provider need to go out there and spend money on a language, literacy and digital assessment robot or a device, or is there something that they can do without having to go to that expense as well, even though you know you could class it as an investment into the process?

Angela Connell-Richards: 10:54

Yeah, and that leads really well into where the next step I wanted to go into is how RTOs are currently handling their language, literacy and numeracy and what do they need to do. So let's talk about practice versus policy. I've seen so many RTOs rely on basic language literacy and numeracy quizzes and call it a day, but if there's no follow-up, no context and no advice given to the student, is that compliant?

Maciek Fibrich: 11:26

Well, I would say no because it clearly says, as part of 2.2b, that based on the outcome of the review, you provide advice to the students. So having it in place is one thing, but your procedure must allow them for that review and that almost feedback, that cycle of information coming to and then going back to the student to say, yep, we think you are suitable for this course or no, we don't think you're suitable based on your language interest and digital assessment.

Angela Connell-Richards: 11:56

Okay, so that leads really well into suitability, and what does that really mean? So let's be clear. This standard isn't about excluding people. It's about helping them to succeed. It's helping them to and it's helping the RTO to really identify is this student suitable? Are they going to be able to complete the training successfully? If a student isn't ready either academically or practically, our job is to give them informed advice. Maybe they need a different training product, maybe they need support, but they deserve to know that before they hand over any money.

Maciek Fibrich: 12:35

Correct, and that's ultimately what these standards are very clear in, especially around that. Standard two is about prior to an enrolment or handing over any money, and I think it even uses that word in a couple of the standards. So, and I think that's a good thing.

Angela Connell-Richards: 12:54

Yeah, I think so too. I think whenever an RTO is setting up a student for success over just getting another enrolment, they're going to have much better outcomes. And then that from there, like completion ratings. Of course we want a high completion rating, but we also want to get a good branding out there of your RTO and if you've got successful completion ratings because you've set up that student for success, you're going to get more enrolments organically, I believe, from there as well.

Maciek Fibrich: 13:27

Yeah look, I agree. My only concern, I guess, with this standard is for the shorter course providers, whether it's first aid, white card et cetera, because, again, the standards I think the intent is always never to be fixed so that it allows for movement between small mother, dad, mum provider versus a large TAFE or larger multinational organisation that's an RTO. I think that this standard may come into question at audits moving forward, especially around the short course mark and whether ASQA is sort of turning a bit of course, or $40 for a RSA or white card, there's no buffer there for an administrative process financially to justify a review and a response type process. So it will be interesting to see how this plays out over the coming few months once the standards come into play.

Angela Connell-Richards: 14:44

Yeah, and watch this space. That's where we really need to look at this. Okay, so let's take a practical example. We said we're going to look at some different units. One is HLTAID011, which is provide first aid. What kind of language, literacy and numeracy digital skills would we reasonably need to assess for this training product? What are your thoughts around first aid and, in particular, digital skills?

Maciek Fibrich: 15:17

Yeah, look, it's an interesting one, isn't it?

Maciek Fibrich: 15:19

Because I've seen I've been a first aider for most of my adult life, even junior life, and as a volunteer firefighter we use first aid as a concept of preserving life until professionals arrive, being paramedics or hospital care.

Maciek Fibrich: 15:38

So, you know, nowadays and I only recently did the refresher for first aid there's really not much requirement for literacy or counting more than to 30, based on CPR, compressions and so forth, and there's almost zero digital requirements, because the only thing that you're really doing is using an AED or a defib and that's verbally talking to you in terms of instructions. So again, when we talk about limiting access to language literacy or to first aid via language literacy, numeracy, it goes against the grain of what first aid is all about, and that is teaching anyone and everyone the fundamentals of preserving life until professionals arrive. So you sort of you know you've picked a good unit there, because I would argue to say, if someone is struggling with language literacy, numeracy, as long as they can verbalize uh, what, what it is as part of the assessment requirements, it would almost be a unit that you'd want everyone to undertake. And so how do you balance that?

Angela Connell-Richards: 16:46

Yeah, and it's really that basic verbal communication, basic literacy, so being able to read, like first aid forms or documents within a first aid kit or maybe those sort of things, and then also that basic numeracy as well, to be able to count compressions, and I have always said, but again, compressions could be in a different language, like if English is not your first language, what's stopping someone counting in Arabic or in Polish, my language, you know.

Angela Connell-Richards: 17:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree with that as well, and I actually believe that everyone should do first aid, I think it should be something that every citizen who really, really wants to be able to be part of a community should do first aid and I've always updated my first aid qualifications over the years from high school because, not for any other reason other than that I know first aid and I can help anybody in an emergency, and I've had to use it on a number of occasions.

Maciek Fibrich: 17:56

Look, and so this is where you know, again, obviously there's tens of thousands of people that do first aid every month, right, and so as a first aid provider whether it's St John's or a private first aid or, you know, an ambulance service this again 2.2b may cause some concerns for people because it's like, well, we don't want to make the enrolment process challenging and difficult to the point where they go away. We don't want to have that as a barrier to entry, but we also need to obviously align to that. So again, yeah, I think you're right. What's this space? I think I'll definitely be getting. Once ASQA has their understanding, I'll be seeking advice from some of their senior people to go okay, how do you intend to audit this for these types of programs?

Angela Connell-Richards: 19:13

Okay, so let's go with what I've heard in the marketplace. Do we need digital skills assessment for first aid?

Maciek Fibrich: 19:24

digital skills assessment for first aid, I would argue that it depends on the delivery mode of the program.

Maciek Fibrich: 19:31

So if you're doing pre-learning prior to the program, so this now is moving away from the individual unit of competency, but looking at what it talks about is your cohort and the program. But looking at what it talks about is your cohort and the program. So my suggestion would be is that if we're delivering the pre-learning via an online platform, which is often what a lot of providers do to shorten the program, then part of that enrolment process should be the basic questions do you have a computer, do you have an internet connection, do you know how to log into a browser? And some basic questions like that, and they are then reviewed. I think we've just sorted out the problem right. So you still ask those questions as part of the application process, whoever's processing the application, even if it's a logic online form. If you tick that the answer is no, then it refers you for further assessment, whereas if you tick yes, then it allows you to do it and therefore you've got almost a review process by default being in the system. That could work.

Angela Connell-Richards: 20:36

So in a snapshot, it's not only looking at the unit of competency and the requirements of the units, it's your delivery mode. So how are you delivering that unit of competency as well, or training product?

Maciek Fibrich: 20:49

And, as you and I have been just verbalising this again challenging the status quo, which is what I sort of love doing it doesn't talk about that. A physical person has to review this right. So here we are, using digital and technology to go. Okay, based on the responses that don't have technological skills to log into a browser, please contact the office or please, you know, look elsewhere for a product that's suitable for you, or something along those lines.

Angela Connell-Richards: 21:32

Or here's an instructional video on how to log in and the process.

Maciek Fibrich: 21:38

Subject to them knowing how to access the video, which, again, it's this loop cycle.

Angela Connell-Richards: 21:42

But yes, yeah, you know, maybe yes, so it's making sure that you have this within your training and assessment strategy.

Maciek Fibrich: 21:50

Yes, strategy document marketing information again. So looking at Standard 2.1, making sure that that's clearly outlined, as well as making sure that your procedures are in place for this assessment process within your RTO.

Angela Connell-Richards: 22:05

Yeah, yeah, certainly I totally agree with all of that.

Maciek Fibrich: 22:09

Yeah, I think there's room there yeah.

Angela Connell-Richards: 22:11

Yeah, now let's look at the total opposite extreme. Looking at a unit BSB INS 501, implement information and knowledge management systems. What language, literacy and numeracy and digital skills may need to come into consideration? Here is really looking at that unit of competency. There's a lot more. It's a high-level literacy and writing skills needed for documentation and policy creation, but also you're going to need to have a strong digital literacy skills, including being able to navigate information systems, databases, communication tech, and you will need so. When you think about this unit of competency, what type of LLND do you think you would need in that area? What type of LLND?

Maciek Fibrich: 23:03

do you think you would need in that area? Yeah, look, 100%, you're right. And again it comes back to the cohort. You know, judging by the code, I believe this would be something that would be appropriate at a diploma level type qualification. So you know, whenever we're looking at those types of qualifications, we're wanting to make sure that, yeah, we're not setting people up to fail. So it's unlikely that.

Maciek Fibrich: 23:30

Well, this unit may be delivered on its own, but it's probably more delivered as part of a program saying yes, uh, rather than just having a five minute enrollment process like you would for an individual unit, like first aid or white card, there would be some depth in the enrollment, in the application process, and a review where it's like okay, where, what is your prior experience?

Maciek Fibrich: 23:55

Because, again, a diploma of business or a diploma of quality auditing or any of those types of qualifications don't have embedded lower qualifications, for example, like hospitality or beauty therapy, et cetera, whereas a diploma of beauty therapy almost embeds a Cert III, a Cert IV and a diploma in it. So here again we're looking at a level of okay, are your literacy, numeracy and digital skills at a level that would support your completion? And then this is where an RTO may choose to have a procedure where it says as part of our application process, we're then going to send you a link to an assessment system, platform, whichever one you go for, to allow for a streamlined assessing process. And so these are times where I do think investing in a platform 100% makes life easier, because they're prepared for that. And again, you know my slogan is do what you do best, outsource the rest. And so if you can outsource that assessment process, integrating it to your enrolment structure, then that may help you, rather than trying to do it manually.

Angela Connell-Richards: 25:12

And then what I would also recommend, because it is a review process. We're not assessing their skills, we're reviewing it could be required skills and knowledge. They might need to hold a Cert 4 in business, or they may need to have a certain years of experience in the workplace using a variety of digital skills, which they could demonstrate through a resume and professional development certificates that they've completed.

Maciek Fibrich: 25:42

And you've raised a very valid point there. We can't just rely on an LLND as the basis of the review, because it does specifically talk about taking into account the requirements of the training product. It has procedures in place to review, prior to NOM, the skills and competencies of the prospective student, including their language literacy and numeracy proficiency and digital literacy. So RTOs must remember that it's not just the LLND that we're focusing on here. As you said, it's what existing skills, competencies or proficiencies they may have that allows them to do this unit or course successfully.

Angela Connell-Richards: 26:22

Yeah, yeah, that allows them to do this unit or course successfully. Yeah, yeah, and it takes me back to when I was delivering. I was delivering Cert 2 to a diploma in business in a year. Can't do that anymore now, but I was delivering that over a year and I was taking recent school leavers from that Certificate 2 to the diploma and it was very, very difficult because Cert 2 and 3 was easy for them, cert 4 was moderately good, but once I got them to the diploma I was really dragging them through, because you can't in a year. They're not working in the workplace, they're only learning what they're learning in the classroom. And those digital skills. Yes, they may be able to do your basic Word, excel, powerpoint and things like that, but it's applying those skills within the workplace. And that's where I struggled with the students because they didn't understand in the real world how to apply those skills.

Maciek Fibrich: 27:22

It's a concept of experiential learning, right? So learning from experience, by practicing and applying, and you know I call it the four A's. So we need to have the ability to acquire the skill and knowledge, absorb it, so time to absorb, which is where that volume of learning and the AQF does play a part.

Angela Connell-Richards: 27:40

Apply, so practice, the skills and then assess On a number of occasions.

Maciek Fibrich: 27:45

Yeah, so it's again. So that's why you know, acquire, absorb, apply and assess. And if you do that and I think the standards sort of spell that out quite well, that you know you need to make sure that there's time for students to practice their skills, and again, not just once.

Angela Connell-Richards: 28:04

Yes.

Maciek Fibrich: 28:05

Because you know we bring in that without opening up Pandora's box here. But you know we haven't spoken a lot about dimensions of competency, which seem to have sort of gone by the wayside a lot. But again, transferability of skill, task skills, task management skills, contingency management skills, et cetera, you know they form part of the dimensions of competency.

Angela Connell-Richards: 28:25

Yeah, and I've seen it now in particular, when you look at the hospitality industry and commercial cookery, and being able to apply the skills on a number of occasions is often not feasible because of the costs of it. Correct and I've discussed this recently like just because you've learnt how to cook a souffle once and then you go straight into an assessment to cook a souffle, it is very, very different from applying that skill on a number of occasions.

Maciek Fibrich: 28:57

Or pouring a draft ale versus a Guinness right Two very different beers and having that ability to transfer those skills, but also which? Again, you know, again we're opening up Pandora's box of credit transfers and so forth. But it really is about ensuring that students can work in a different environment, but without going overboard as well.

Maciek Fibrich: 29:19

Yeah, you know you're not going to teach a student to use 10 different types of defibs, but you're going to get them to use one. But tell them that the others, how the others work, you know so yeah, and what are the variances um?

Angela Connell-Richards: 29:32

that there may be. Yeah, yeah, okay. So let's look at the risks and the compliance gaps if we're going to be helping our audience with understanding this. What do you believe are the biggest risks that RTOs will be facing when it comes to Standard 2.2 and language, literacy, numeracy and digital skills?

Maciek Fibrich: 29:53

As I said earlier, I think the biggest risk is going to be to the providers that are focusing on the sales of direct entry through an enrolment process, an online enrolment process, and this is not new Again.

Maciek Fibrich: 30:10

The standards have always been there prior to enrolment or commencement of study. Whichever comes first was the existing wording, and so I've always been an advocate of using the term apply for enrollment, which then doesn't give the uh the the sense that I've got an automatic entry into the program. That is an application process. So from my perspective, the biggest risk is failing to assess a student's um existing skills and knowledge, uh, whether that's through the enrolment form or through another questionnaire, and choosing not to review their language, literacy, numeracy and digital skills. Through whichever method you use, be whatever's appropriate for that product and your delivery approach. They're the probably two things that especially around 2.2, is going to cause issues, as well as not assessing the student's ability to access particular types of, say, physical resources that might be required to complete that training. So if you don't talk about the need to have a computer, because we assume that everyone's got a device, but we can't make that assumption- no, we can't, certainly not.

Angela Connell-Richards: 31:24

So how can RTOs put all this into a simple, scalable process?

Maciek Fibrich: 31:30

easy ask chat gpt? No, don't. I look you and I play in ai so much and we know that it doesn't get it right. Look, um, the honestly the best way, and I've just spent the last couple of months, like you and like everyone else, putting uh appropriate materials together for new applicants and existing rtos existing rtos, really, without upsetting colleagues. Don't go out there and buy a suite of generic documents, right? That's my opinion.

Angela Connell-Richards: 32:03

One thing I've seen is you definitely need to have it specifically written for the training products that you are delivering 100%.

Maciek Fibrich: 32:12

And just literally yesterday I was reviewing for a client their policy around standard one and the fundamental thing is, you know they deliver a unit of competency, but within their policy they talk about qualifications, skill sets and accredited courses and I'm like, why, like you know, make it relevant to your business? So how can you put a system? Look, read the practice guides, read the outcome policy, standards policy guidance that was released in march by dur. Get an understanding of it. The biggest failing of any rto, the ceo or manager, is listening to the internet about mythical requirements that don't exist. Is point one. And secondly, a really um a desire to want to understand the standards. So read the standards and then seek advice from people like yourself or me. Uh to go, can you explain how we can interpret this and apply it within our business? Don't just go off what pub talk and and and chat groups and so forth, because it's not always right and neither is chat gpt um.

Angela Connell-Richards: 33:22

However, in saying that, I think you can use chat gpt, but you need to use it in a smart way.

Maciek Fibrich: 33:29

So yeah, you use ai as much as you can. Both you and I are advocates of AI. 100% Use AI. But again, poo in, poo out, crap in, crap out. If you haven't taught the system right, it's going to make stuff up and, unless you're prepared to fact check it, it's going to come up with standards that don't exist. It's going to come up with numbering that doesn't exist and it's going to make you look silly.

Angela Connell-Richards: 33:57

Yeah, I've spent over three years training mine, so it's quite knowledgeable now. But what I would recommend if you are going to use ChatGPT is taking the unit or the training product. So, whatever you're developing, go to traininggovau and upload that into ChatGPT, as well as the practice guides and the standard for writing the language, literacy and numeracy and then getting ChatGPT to ask you questions based on that. So it's not just here, it is now. Write me something, review all of this and then ask me any further questions, as I am the industry expert of how I could develop a language, literacy and numeracy tool based on what are the requirements?

Maciek Fibrich: 34:44

As I say, it's not the Mona Lisa right, it's not going to be a work of art by simply getting it, but it's far better than a blank canvas. And if you've got your framework, you say to it right, as a starting point, I need you to do X, y, z and then use it. Don't just don't think one prompt's going to give you a response. Use it, advance it, expand on it, rewrite it use it like, use it as a draft, but what ultimately it does for you? It makes your life easier and faster, but you still need to have that base understanding, because if you don't, you're going to produce rubbish.

Angela Connell-Richards: 35:22

Yeah, and you can't think that ChatGPT is smarter than you when it comes to your industry skills and knowledge and your business?

Maciek Fibrich: 35:26

It doesn't know your business, right yeah. So you need to be sure that you're aligning everything that it produces within your context.

Angela Connell-Richards: 35:33

Yeah, they're a very skilled research assistant, but you need to take that research and then implement it the best way for you and your students.

Maciek Fibrich: 35:43

As I've said, it's the smartest, dumbest intern you'll ever have.

Angela Connell-Richards: 35:46

Yes, yes, yes. Okay, all right, this has been really good having a chat about this, because I know it is an area where a lot of people are struggling. Do they need to go out and buy materials? Essentially, the answer is you really need to identify. You'll learn a cohort. What are their skills, existing skills and knowledge, the training product, and what skills and knowledge will they need in order to successfully complete that training product?

Maciek Fibrich: 36:17

And also the volume of students that you're trying to push through right.

Angela Connell-Richards: 36:20

Correct, yeah.

Maciek Fibrich: 36:23

If you've got 10 students a year, it really may be just appropriate not to.

Angela Connell-Richards: 36:30

Yeah, yeah, whereas if you've got, you know like I used to deliver a RSA class once or twice a week and we would have 30 students per class for that, I would be really looking at what are the so definitely need language literacy and numeracy when it comes to RSA Responsible Service of Alcohol because they need to be able to read signs and they need to be able to measure, and they also need to be able to read body language signals as well. But when it comes to digital, signals Hang on.

Maciek Fibrich: 37:06

Are we adding emotional intelligence to LLNM? Oh, dear God, Good thing. Next thing you'll say we've got to assess common sense. Oh, yeah God, Good thing Next thing you'll say we've got to assess common sense.

Angela Connell-Richards: 37:18

Oh, yeah, yeah. Well, I don't think there's a lot of common sense when it comes to trying to deal with drunk people, but anyway.

Angela Connell-Richards: 37:27

So if you're not sure where to start, I've actually created a checklist, a compliance checklist for Standard 2.2 on how you can map your language, literacy and numeracy, including using ChatGPT for that as well, and really looking at what it's diving into that who are your learner cohort, what are their existing skills and knowledge and what does the training product require? And they're the key areas that you need to really identify. And do you need to go rush out and buy any software? That's really up to you and it really is up to the training products that you have. It doesn't stipulate anywhere within the standard that you must have a digital assessment tool. It just says that you are reviewing and setting the student up for success.

Maciek Fibrich: 38:18

Yeah, I agree.

Angela Connell-Richards: 38:20

Yeah, thanks again, maytek. This episode really clears the fog around language literacy and numeracy To all of our listeners. You can download our new language literacy suitability planning template from the show notes and if you've still got any questions, go to the rto community on facebook. We have a huge community on our facebook group that are asking questions all the time, and it's often where I get the content for our future episodes of uh, of the rto superhero, because, uh, they're asking questions all the time. It's a great place for me to go because I am able to answer those questions through the forum, but also through our podcast as well. So until next time, stay compliant, stay confident and keep empowering your learners. There you go.